Intuition's Blog

[Intuition]

Hello, this will be a blog of my experiences and investigation.

I shall post about what my current contemplative practices are.

Current Contemplative Practice - Currently, I reside in the second jhana at all times. This means that the mind is stilled at all times. Aka, no-mind, inner silence, inner stillness. Whatever name you would like to give to this state of consciousness. The 2nd Jhana. My practice for getting this charism to arise is as follows. Each day, I watch the thoughtstream of the mind. I call this a feeling-action or intuitive-action. It is a non-conceptual action. Aka, you don't watch the thoughtstream by thinking. Instead, watching the thoughtstream is a non-conceptual action. I disidentify from it, and just watch it, until it burns itself out, and I am left with a still mind. If you have been trapped in thinking lately, this charism (no-mind) may not arise immediately, especially if the mind is filled with anxiety, restlessness, and has been running amuck. But, remain as the watcher for long enough, watch it long enough, and let it burn itself out, and a still mind will inevitably arise. Then, I shift to just living my life in the present moment, with a still mind at all times. Once the charism of no-mind has arisen, I try to drop watching the mind, and I shift to just living in the present moment with a still mind. Anytime thought comes back up, I watch it until it burns itself all out, and I return to living in the present moment with a still mind.

On Other Methods - I would also like to mention that I actually believe there are many methods to get the charism of a still mind to arise. As, I can get it to arise by meditating on my breath. Meditating on my body. Meditating on a sound. Meditating on a kasina. Once no-mind has arisen, though, whatever method you used to get it to arise, should be dropped.

Questions - I have been investigating the GWV for a while now, and over this time, I've accumulated and prepared a few questions, which I'd like to ask to Jhananda now, as I am seeking further guidance of the mystical path:

1. As you have read above, once the charism of a still mind has arisen, my practice is to drop the watching of the mind, and shift to living in the present moment with a still mind. This actually, has been a point of investigation/confusion for me - what exactly you 'do' after the charism of no-mind arises, and you drop the tool/meditation object that got you there. For me, it is living in the present moment, with inner silence/no thought. But what is it for you, Jhananda? I have read in certain places that you take no-mind as your meditation object, but what exactly do you mean by that? I have also read in certain places that you do similar to what I do, which is to simply live in the present moment with a still mind.

2. I have read in various places on this forum and on the GWV website that sometimes Jhananda, you describe the 2nd jhana as some sort of non-dual attainment. To me, the stilling of the mind doesn't feel non-dual. I would not describe stilling the mind as non-dual. The absence of thought does not feel non-dual. It basically feels like - my normal life - with no thought. With no thinking. I'm still here, operating the body, living my life, etc, etc - there's just no thought. It's pretty much like my life was before - without any thought. I fail to see how this is non-dual. Can you please elucidate on this? I have also seen you describe the jhanas as increasing shades of non-dual experience, perhaps what I have described is what you meant, but just that it is a light shade of non-dual experience. I have had, though, after this state of no-mind, experiences that I would describe as non-dual, where my sense of self drops away, and there a sort of center-less awareness of all of the present moment. This I would describe as more non-dual. Perhaps this is what you mean when you describe the third jhana in http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/criticism/transitionalabsorption.htm  'But, this does not mean that one is ambivalent to sensory phenomena or that the senses are completely effaced, they are simply observed without perception, thinking or reasoning being involved, thus thinking and reasoning fall away by the second stage of absorption and perception falls away by the third stage of absorption.'

3. After reading lots of material of the GWV I have come to the following understanding of contemplative practice (meditation steps), but my understand is incomplete. The following is my understanding of what you do in each jhana to get the next charism to arise. Can you please fill in the gaps?
+1st jhana (Simple pleasure in the spiritual life) - Use some contemplative tool to get the still mind to arise. ie. steady the mind on a meditation object until the charism of a still mind arises.
+2nd jhana (Still mind) - Drop the meditation object. Stay with that still mind and in the still mind until other charisms arise (How do you do this? ie. stay with that still mind. What are you doing? This is the same as my earlier question. In some of your material, I hear you say that you take the still mind as your object. What exactly do you mean by this? For me, the second jhana is stilling the mind and then living in the present moment, without thought.)
+3rd jhana (charisms) - Take these new charisms, such as singling sensations in the body as your meditation object until ?? happens
+4th jhana (Characterised by ??) - ??

[Jhanananda]

Hello, this will be a blog of my experiences and investigation.

I shall post about what my current contemplative practices are.

Current Contemplative Practice - Currently, I reside in the second jhana at all times. This means that the mind is stilled at all times. Aka, no-mind, inner silence, inner stillness. Whatever name you would like to give to this state of consciousness. The 2nd Jhana. My practice for getting this charism to arise is as follows. Each day, I watch the thoughtstream of the mind. I call this a feeling-action or intuitive-action. It is a non-conceptual action. Aka, you don't watch the thoughtstream by thinking. Instead, watching the thoughtstream is a non-conceptual action. I disidentify from it, and just watch it, until it burns itself out, and I am left with a still mind. If you have been trapped in thinking lately, this charism (no-mind) may not arise immediately, especially if the mind is filled with anxiety, restlessness, and has been running amuck. But, remain as the watcher for long enough, watch it long enough, and let it burn itself out, and a still mind will inevitably arise. Then, I shift to just living my life in the present moment, with a still mind at all times. Once the charism of no-mind has arisen, I try to drop watching the mind, and I shift to just living in the present moment with a still mind. Anytime thought comes back up, I watch it until it burns itself all out, and I return to living in the present moment with a still mind.

This is essentially the method that I employed to arrive at the 2nd jhana.  I did observe the breath as a precursor to observing the thought stream.  Once I arrived at the still mind of no-mind, I then observed the still mind as my new meditation object.  This lead to the 3rd jhana, which is characterized by the arising of various non-sensory phenomena arising in all of the sense gates.  At that point I observed the various non-sensory phenomena as my new meditation object.  This lead to a timeless domain which is characteristic of the 4th jhana.  I then observed this timeless domain, until a luminous sphere arose, which flashed into a kaleidoscopic ride into the immaterial domains, which is the 5th samadhi.

On Other Methods - I would also like to mention that I actually believe there are many methods to get the charism of a still mind to arise. As, I can get it to arise by meditating on my breath. Meditating on my body. Meditating on a sound. Meditating on a kasina. Once no-mind has arisen, though, whatever method you used to get it to arise, should be dropped.

I fully agree.

Questions - I have been investigating the GWV for a while now, and over this time, I've accumulated and prepared a few questions, which I'd like to ask to Jhananda now, as I am seeking further guidance of the mystical path:

1. As you have read above, once the charism of a still mind has arisen, my practice is to drop the watching of the mind, and shift to living in the present moment with a still mind. This actually, has been a point of investigation/confusion for me - what exactly you 'do' after the charism of no-mind arises, and you drop the tool/meditation object that got you there. For me, it is living in the present moment, with inner silence/no thought. But what is it for you, Jhananda? I have read in certain places that you take no-mind as your meditation object, but what exactly do you mean by that? I have also read in certain places that you do similar to what I do, which is to simply live in the present moment with a still mind.

See above.  I use the stage of samadhi as my new meditation object.  However, deep meditation requires 24/7 vigilance, of keeping the mind still, and in the present moment; however, once the various sensory charisms arise, then it is possible to keep them present 24/7, and I do so.

2. I have read in various places on this forum and on the GWV website that sometimes Jhananda, you describe the 2nd jhana as some sort of non-dual attainment. To me, the stilling of the mind doesn't feel non-dual. I would not describe stilling the mind as non-dual. The absence of thought does not feel non-dual. It basically feels like - my normal life - with no thought. With no thinking. I'm still here, operating the body, living my life, etc, etc - there's just no thought. It's pretty much like my life was before - without any thought. I fail to see how this is non-dual. Can you please elucidate on this? I have also seen you describe the jhanas as increasing shades of non-dual experience, perhaps what I have described is what you meant, but just that it is a light shade of non-dual experience. I have had, though, after this state of no-mind, experiences that I would describe as non-dual, where my sense of self drops away, and there a sort of center-less awareness of all of the present moment. This I would describe as more non-dual. Perhaps this is what you mean when you describe the third jhana in http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/criticism/transitionalabsorption.htm  'But, this does not mean that one is ambivalent to sensory phenomena or that the senses are completely effaced, they are simply observed without perception, thinking or reasoning being involved, thus thinking and reasoning fall away by the second stage of absorption and perception falls away by the third stage of absorption.'

The 2nd jhana is not that profound for most people, as you described for yourself; however, self-hood is reinforced by thought, so as you distance yourself from thinking, you are likely to find a rise of non-dualism.  And, as you described, as the state deepens beyond the 2nd jhana, then it becomes even more non-dual.

3. After reading lots of material of the GWV I have come to the following understanding of contemplative practice (meditation steps), but my understand is incomplete. The following is my understanding of what you do in each jhana to get the next charism to arise. Can you please fill in the gaps?
+1st jhana (Simple pleasure in the spiritual life) - Use some contemplative tool to get the still mind to arise. ie. steady the mind on a meditation object until the charism of a still mind arises.
+2nd jhana (Still mind) - Drop the meditation object. Stay with that still mind and in the still mind until other charisms arise (How do you do this? ie. stay with that still mind. What are you doing? This is the same as my earlier question. In some of your material, I hear you say that you take the still mind as your object. What exactly do you mean by this? For me, the second jhana is stilling the mind and then living in the present moment, without thought.)
+3rd jhana (charisms) - Take these new charisms, such as singling sensations in the body as your meditation object until ?? happens
+4th jhana (Characterised by ??) - ??

OK, I have described the idea of using the experience of depth in meditation as a meditation object.  Is to "savor" it.  What I mean by this is to fill your experience with the new phenomena, and value it.  Recognize it as sacred; and be with it for as long as you can sustain it.

I hope these words help you deepen your contemplative life.  Thank-you for posting your inquiry, because it helps others to read your inquiry.

[Intuition]

Jhanananda, I thank you very much for you response. Can you clarify a few things, or expound upon them?

Once I arrived at the still mind of no-mind, I then observed the still mind as my new meditation object.

I then observed this timeless domain

What exactly do you mean by this? How do you 'observe' the still mind/take it as your meditation object? I understand that this may be difficult to answer, because we are entering into non-conceptual actions, and here we are, trying to use words (which are conceptual). But could you try?
For me, the 2nd jhana is living in the present moment with a still mind. I use a method to get the still mind to arise. Once it has arisen, I shift to living in the present moment with that still mind. That's how I sustain the second Jhana.
But for you, once the still mind arises, you observe the still mind/keep it as your meditation object. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this. Perhaps you mean the exact same thing as me, and we are saying it differently. Also, when you say that you observed this timeless domain, what do you mean by this? I feel that clarification on this, the best you can, would be of great help to many.

See above.  I use the stage of samadhi as my new meditation object.  However, deep meditation requires 24/7 vigilance, of keeping the mind still, and in the present moment; however, once the various sensory charisms arise, then it is possible to keep them present 24/7, and I do so

So basically, essentially, you are saying that off-the mat 24/7 practice is to keep the mind still, and present, correct? We have discussed the contemplative practice necessary to giving rise to this still mind, but what is your practice to keep the mind present? Do you simply intend to be in the present moment, and therefore it is done?

Thank you Jhanananda


Also, another point

Contemplative practices vs results - I think we should always differentiate between contemplative practices and results. As you have made very clear, jhana is a result of living a contemplative life. The still mind is the result of one of various contemplative practice, some of which we have mentioned. But, I would like to discuss 'being present'. Is this a result, or is it a contemplative practice? Is it a result of stilling the mind, or is it a contemplative practice itself to always strive to abide in the here-now. This remains a point of wonder for me. I think the best I can say currently is that it is a contemplative practice rather than a result, that you really need a still mind to successfully actually do.


Edit: Edited a couple things.

[Jhanananda]

Jhanananda, I thank you very much for you response. Can you clarify a few things, or expound upon them?

Once I arrived at the still mind of no-mind, I then observed the still mind as my new meditation object.

I then observed this timeless domain

What exactly do you mean by this? How do you 'observe' the still mind/take it as your meditation object? I understand that this may be difficult to answer, because we are entering into non-conceptual actions, and here we are, trying to use words (which are conceptual). But could you try?
For me, the 2nd jhana is living in the present moment with a still mind. I use a method to get the still mind to arise. Once it has arisen, I shift to living in the present moment with that still mind. That's how I sustain the second Jhana.
But for you, once the still mind arises, you observe the still mind/keep it as your meditation object. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this. Perhaps you mean the exact same thing as me, and we are saying it differently. Also, when you say that you observed this timeless domain, what do you mean by this? I feel that clarification on this, the best you can, would be of great help to many.

I used the term 'savor.'  It is just to be present in that still mind indefinitely.

See above.  I use the stage of samadhi as my new meditation object.  However, deep meditation requires 24/7 vigilance, of keeping the mind still, and in the present moment; however, once the various sensory charisms arise, then it is possible to keep them present 24/7, and I do so

So basically, essentially, you are saying that off-the mat 24/7 practice is to keep the mind still, and present, correct?

Correct

We have discussed the contemplative practice necessary to giving rise to this still mind, but what is your practice to keep the mind present? Do you simply intend to be in the present moment, and therefore it is done?

I follow the Noble Eightfold Path, because just meditating is not enough.  One must also lead a "righteous lifestyle," which the Noble Eightfold Path is an excellent description of.

Thank you Jhanananda


Also, another point

Contemplative practices vs results - I think we should always differentiate between contemplative practices and results. As you have made very clear, jhana is a result of living a contemplative life. The still mind is the result of one of various contemplative practice, some of which we have mentioned. But, I would like to discuss 'being present'. Is this a result, or is it a contemplative practice? Is it a result of stilling the mind, or is it a contemplative practice itself to always strive to abide in the here-now. This remains a point of wonder for me. I think the best I can say currently is that it is a contemplative practice rather than a result, that you really need a still mind to successfully actually do.


Edit: Edited a couple things.

Yes:

the term 'practices' in Pali is 'Magga'
The term 'result'  in Pali is 'phala,' which literally means 'fruit.'  This forum is all about the results or fruit of the contemplative life, because, while there are many teachers of meditation today, it seems none of them understand the  results or fruit of the contemplative life.  Practice without fruit leads nowhere.

Yes, I agree, being present in the moment requires a still mind, so they are both fruit; however, someone who is not a contemplative could be present in the moment for a short period of time.  However, to sustain that present moment requires leading a 'righteous,' self-aware contemplative life, which has born the fruit of the still mind.  We do not get there by believing.  We get there by leading a 'righteous,' self-aware contemplative life.