Impact of inner silence on other people

[Jean]

I could not find any discussion on the impact of developing inner silence on people around us, including children, friends, colleagues, and partners. I am curious to learn more about your experiences with this.

I'm not very social and prefer to stay on my own but occasionally I do meet people. For a couple of years, I noticed something changed when I'm with someone. 
Here are some examples :

- I met a sensitive female friend living abroad. She visited Belgium. We were having a drink on a busy terrace. A couple of minutes after sitting down, she was shocked by the silence around us and in her head too. This had never happened to her before.
- My work changed a couple of years ago. I used to have a very technical job and had the chance to remotely coach apprentices in the UK for whom my company was paying a university degree. They were doing rotations in different parts of the business and my role was to guide them and ensure they were doing the expected work. It happened that for a couple of them, they suddenly started crying during our 1-to-1 business discussions. I was listening to them deeply. They started sharing about some traumatic events from their past or difficulties in their life. They never dared speak about those before to anyone. I redirected them to a counselor and some psychological help.
- From time to time I go and seek help from therapists. It happened 3 times, with older male therapists that they started speaking about their private life and suffering and started crying. I was also sitting there in silence.
- I have a girlfriend since July. She's a very yang, independent and solitary woman by nature. She's also sensitive, had kundalini awakenings and trying to live life with a lot of pain at times in her neck, trigeminal nerve and kidneys. When we are together she has the impression to be at home and deeply relax when I touch her. This never happened in her life before. When we made love she found herself in a completely white serene space she never experienced before. All her physical pain disappear for a while after making love.

I understand that it might not be easy to reflect on certain experiences, but your insights could be helpful. If you're comfortable with it, I would love to hear more about your experience with that matter.

[Michael Hawkins]

- I have a girlfriend since July. She's a very yang, independent and solitary woman by nature. She's also sensitive, had kundalini awakenings and trying to live life with a lot of pain at times in her neck, trigeminal nerve and kidneys. When we are together she has the impression to be at home and deeply relax when I touch her. This never happened in her life before. When we made love she found herself in a completely white serene space she never experienced before. All her physical pain disappear for a while after making love.

Thank you for opening this topic, Jean.

I'm focusing on the last bullet point, with regard to your girlfriend and her pleasant, healing experiences being close with you.

I just wrote a reflection on a grieving process I'm currently moving through (https://rightabsorption.wordpress.com/2024/03/06/the-dukkha-of-grieving/).  While I had been good friends with this woman for 15 years, only in the past several months had our relationship grown into something more serious - even though she lives in England while I'm in the States, and I never got to hear her voice.  We shared many intimate and challenging things with one another, to the point where it seemed obvious that our connection had entered a new phase.

At one point around Christmas it was my time for evening meditation.  I texted her that I was about to sit, and would she like to join me?  She did.

She reported back in half an hour that her long-dormant kundalini had re-awakened, and that it had spiked through the roof.  She directly attributed it to my absorption states.  Initially she was very excited and happy about this turn of events.

Unfortunately, she subsequently reported that she was unable to function "normally" due to the spikes and fluctuations of the kundalini energy, which never seemed to stabilize.  I directed her to this forum and specifically to Jeffrey, but I don't think she ever reached out.  I have a few female friends who have navigated their own kundalini awakenings and offered to put her in touch with them, but she was not open to it.

In her case, all of her life's trauma came flooding in with the ecstasy, and now she is no longer with us.

So, what I learned is that it can work both ways, depending on where the person is on their healing journey.  I'm not saying that the re-emergence of kundalini killed her, but she was definitely overwhelmed by it at times, and it combined with other physical, mental and emotional challenges to make her life very difficult.  So, this is part of the grieving, knowing that the presence of ecstasy and mind-stillness in me may trigger something overwhelming and traumatizing in another.

I know that there is a higher intelligence behind these things, having to do with kamma/karma and personal responsibility.  For myself, this teaches me to be more careful in terms of being intimate with others around what amounts to universal creative/destructive energy.  I'd assumed that it would lead to good things all around, but that's not necessarily true.

[Jean]

Hi Michael,

My heart goes out to you in this difficult time. The pain of losing someone we hold dear is an indescribable journey, one that often feels impossible to navigate. I know this all too well, having experienced the sudden and devastating loss of my younger sister in a car accident when she was just 23. It's a moment that forever alters the landscape of our lives.

Please know, your intention to share a space of healing through meditation with your friend was pure. It's clear you never meant any harm; on the contrary, you sought to offer comfort. Like you've beautifully expressed, life has an intelligence of its own, and we find ourselves at times as instruments within its vast orchestration. The pain you're feeling is real and valid.

Speaking from my own heartache, that harrowing time became an unexpected invitation to explore the depths of my emotions. It urged me to connect with the parts of my own history and wounds that each wave of grief echoed. It's a process of feeling deeply, then releasing—layer by layer. The loss I endured ultimately led me to a deeper self-awareness and a more compassionate approach, both towards others and, crucially, towards myself.

The guilt I carried was immense and took time to work through. Now, I find myself in a place of heightened consciousness, recognizing that my very presence can be a catalyst for either creation or destruction. With this knowledge, I strive to bring balance to disharmony, offering it freely and unconditionally. I've come to see that, for some, my presence may initiate an unraveling process, while for others, it may not—whether it be with fellow human beings or in the natural environments I've called homes.

Destruction, as harsh as it may sound, is sometimes a necessary precursor for new growth, for something beautiful to emerge from the ashes. In sharing this with you, my hope is not to diminish your sorrow but to offer a hand to hold as you walk this path. Your journey is uniquely yours, yet you are not alone. May you find strength and healing in the days to come.

[Michael Hawkins]

Thank you for this amazing response, Jean.  I am so grateful to read these words.

life has an intelligence of its own, and we find ourselves at times as instruments within its vast orchestration.

Well-said, a true affirmation.

It urged me to connect with the parts of my own history and wounds that each wave of grief echoed. It's a process of feeling deeply, then releasing—layer by layer.

As mentioned in the blog post linked above, I'm endeavoring this time to focus on my attachment, or my craving/clinging, to the feelings of pain and suffering.  In the past I have identified with the things that arise during grieving, made them a part of me, so that I carried them forward into the next episode, entraining myself to respond according to self-imposed conditioning due to lack of internal awareness.  Now I'm working to allow whatever is there to exist, and to see how I have a choice around whether or not to remain attached to it.  There really is a craving to cling to suffering (in my case), just as there is a craving to cling to the joyful - and both end up as suffering if I don't allow them to rise and fall according to their own rhythms.  It's not about avoiding or evading the gut-wrenching aspects of losing someone I love - in fact, I want to feel the full impact.  Learning to allow the waves to come and go, without integrating the trauma, is the lesson this time around.  In doing so, perhaps past trauma will resolve as well.

The guilt I carried was immense and took time to work through. Now, I find myself in a place of heightened consciousness, recognizing that my very presence can be a catalyst for either creation or destruction. With this knowledge, I strive to bring balance to disharmony, offering it freely and unconditionally.

So, I am just at the beginning of this process, where I feel the guilt and horror of having catalyzed her suffering, but hoping to develop faith that, in having pure intentions, I'm simply an agent of higher intelligence - and that it's okay to freely give from the deeper fruits.  Right now, I'm frankly scared to death that I am potentially toxic in this way, and feel like crawling into a cave - but I know that this feeling is also impermanent, and it's not really me.

Destruction, as harsh as it may sound, is sometimes a necessary precursor for new growth, for something beautiful to emerge from the ashes.

This is a profound truth, and I hope to arrive there through my own experience, when the dust settles.

Thank you again for your compassionate response, Jean.

[Jean]

There really is a craving to cling to suffering (in my case), just as there is a craving to cling to the joyful - and both end up as suffering if I don't allow them to rise and fall according to their own rhythms.  It's not about avoiding or evading the gut-wrenching aspects of losing someone I love - in fact, I want to feel the full impact.  Learning to allow the waves to come and go, without integrating the trauma, is the lesson this time around.  In doing so, perhaps past trauma will resolve as well.

Feeling is the essence of being alive. Pain is a genuine experience, but suffering is a choice we make. I have observed that many people hold on to their emotional states as a way to feel alive. Personally, I am still striving to achieve a state of equanimity. However, the more I journey through life, the more I learn to be gentle with myself and simply observe what is happening around me.

Right now, I'm frankly scared to death that I am potentially toxic in this way, and feel like crawling into a cave - but I know that this feeling is also impermanent, and it's not really me.

I understand how you may feel about yourself, but please know that you are not a toxic person. In fact, I can feel the goodness and see the light within you. I stand by your side. Take good care of yourself Michael.

[Michael Hawkins]

I understand how you may feel about yourself, but please know that you are not a toxic person. In fact, I can feel the goodness and see the light within you. I stand by your side. Take good care of yourself Michael.

Thank you, Jean.  As a person, I know that my heart and intentions are in the right place, and I agree that it takes time for the waves to pass through.  I'll be in a different place with this before long.  I very much appreciate your support here.

[Jhanananda]

To start from the thesis of this thread, yes, I have had many experiences with people who found benefit in my company. I have been working from the essential principal that "we know a tree by its fruit..." which is how we function here. So, I fathered 2 children and did not emphasis indoctrination instead hoping my children would learn from my example. And, my 2 wives I met at 10-day meditation retreats assuming that anyone who made the investment to attend one must be a dedicated contemplative, which I found out was not true from either of my ex-wives. I came to realize that they thought they were going to benefit spiritually through osmosis, which is a delusion. We all need to make the effort to lead a life that follows the Noble Eightfold Path.

So, I am sorry, Michael for your loss of a friend, but when I read that her "kundalini" had been "activated" and it had become a traumatic experience for her, then I recall Gopi Krishna who published an irresponsible book representing kundalini as some kind of disease. In my experience he only demonstrated he knew nothing about kundalini. He was passing off his own psychosis as a religious experience.

So, I don't know your friend at all, but as we have been discussing here, life in the material world is a disaster, which we can only resolve by saturation in the ecstasies to the point that we no longer have craving and covetousness for the material world.

[Michael Hawkins]

So, I am sorry, Michael for your loss of a friend, but when I read that her "kundalini" had been "activated" and it had become a traumatic experience for her, then I recall Kopi Krishna who published an irresponsible book representing kundalini as some kind of disease. In my experience he only demonstrated he knew nothing kundalini. He was passing of his own psychosis as a religious experience.

So, I don't know your friend at all, but as we have been discussing here, life in the material world is a disaster, which we can only resolve by saturation in the ecstasies to the point that we no longer have graving and covetousness for the material world.

I really wish she would've contacted you, or joined the forum.  My own experience with kundalini, along with experiences reported by several friends, is that one must open to it, allow it to move through, get out of the way.  It can be unpleasant because it is exposing many of our deepest wounds, but it also has an intelligence of its own, which needs to be trusted.  She unfortunately demonized it, calling it a "false demon," and fell back on a fundamentalist Christian resistance strategy that only amplified her torment.  But I also know that she was afraid and didn't feel like anyone could help her.  It is tragic all around, because she was a very good person.

As for the original theme of Jean's post, I've had the experience several times of people coming up to me and saying something like, "Your energy is amazing, I want some of what you took," etc.  It also makes me think of the adage that says, even if no one knows about your meditation practice, the whole world benefits.  Bringing more Life energy into the realm has got to be a good thing, ultimately.

[Jhanananda]

I really wish she would've contacted you, or joined the forum.  My own experience with kundalini, along with experiences reported by several friends, is that one must open to it, allow it to move through, get out of the way.  It can be unpleasant because it is exposing many of our deepest wounds, but it also has an intelligence of its own, which needs to be trusted.  She unfortunately demonized it, calling it a "false demon," and fell back on a fundamentalist Christian resistance strategy that only amplified her torment.  But I also know that she was afraid and didn't feel like anyone could help her.  It is tragic all around, because she was a very good person.

I agree with you, and others here, we do have to open and submit and take refuge in the religious experience, because it is a transformational one and requires submission to the process; but I also agree with you no one seems to know about the process other than a genuine mystic and there is so much delusion rampant in organized religion as well as non-aligned forms who are we going to trust? I spent 27 searching and being misdirected and even marginalized by gurus who were just working the crowd for as much as they could milk them for, and anyone who might be a genuine mystic was going to eventually expose them, so the mystics got marginalized.

As for the original theme of Jean's post, I've had the experience several times of people coming up to me and saying something like, "Your energy is amazing, I want some of what you took," etc.  It also makes me think of the adage that says, even if no one knows about your meditation practice, the whole world benefits.  Bringing more Life energy into the realm has got to be a good thing, ultimately.

Yes, I have had many people report that meditating in my company tended to produce deeper meditation experiences for them, but as you experienced with your friend, often that deeper meditation experience can be profound and even frightening when their is no context for the experience, so they could just as easily become a threat, which might be the original origin of witch-burning whereby a local mystic who was already marginalized by the priesthood aided someone to greater depth, which is often understood in a historical context as an initiation, ended up burned at the stake because the person they helped was terrified of the profound experience of a genuine religious experience.