Fruit of the Contemplative Life
Fruit of the contemplative life: => Contemplative Blogs => : Alexander September 04, 2019, 03:18:13 PM
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Hello all, I wanted to get your thoughts on practice. As you know, I have been at this for over a decade (;p) and have become quite the scholar of mysticism. But, I would still like to attain (1) the OOBE, (2) the state in which the sense of I is "lost," and (3) the experience of powerful energy (viriya). I expected these to just "happen" over the years, but they haven't come, so I've kept experimenting and practicing.
My practice lately has been a daily minimum of 2 hours of meditation. Keep in mind I will sometimes go over this. I get the two hours from the Spanish mystics (Teresa of Avila, John of the Cross) who used this as their rule for the Carmelites. I felt this was a good number for balance with work and other life commitments. I have felt for years I would happily meditate all day (4-6+ hours) - but nothing ever seems to come of the days I do so; it is just my ordinary state of consciousness persisting even when I am sitting for that long.
Some thoughts:
1. 24/7 Practices
By this I am referring to mindfulness (sati - Buddhism), watchfulness (nepsis - Eastern Christianity), self-remembering (Gurdjieff), self-enquiry (Ramana Maharshi), walking meditation, and so on (all these names referring to effectively the same thing - stilling the mind and remaining self-aware throughout the day).
While I do feel this practice has a lot of value in bringing self-mastery and quieting the self, after a decade I am coming to the conclusion that this practice is useless when it comes to attaining the fruits of the spirit. It does not seem to have any effect on producing lucidity during sleep, OOBEs, energy, etc.
Having said that, Ramana Maharshi and Gary Weber both testify they attained their state of I "loss" as being a product of this practice. So, I remain open to it leading to this - but after 10 years, so far, this has not struck me yet "like a thunderbolt."
2. Short sits
By short sits I am referring to meditations that are for 10, 20, or 30 minute periods. In my logs I will record all my short sits for the day; for example, I will get up cumulatively to 2 hours, or on other days several hours (3-4) practicing like this. But, after practicing in this way for years, I have not seen any results. I have scoured the tomes of mysticism but they are devoid of clear "dos" or "don'ts" on topics like this. But, it seems that short sits do not bring any fruits.
3. Long sits
This has been my more recent practice, doing a minimum of one 60-90 minute long sit per day. Bob Monroe says when doing this a "vibrational state" is supposed to come, and while I do feel vibrations from time to time, they do not deepen to anything I can exit from. It is mostly the same state of consciousness as the waking state.
Recently, I had a couple of interesting discoveries that I wanted to share:
1. One of these is that it is interesting that Bob Monroe, William Buhlman, and the OOBE writers I know have no mention at all of the state of I "loss" in their writings.
2. And in the opposite direction, Ramana Maharshi, Gary Weber, and the nondualists describe a state of I "loss" but don't have any discussion on the OOBE.
...It just seems fascinating that these two above are both "schools" of mysticism but they don't seem to overlap. A "complete" perspective should likely include both of them.
Anyway, my current practice is to try to carry on with a minimum of one long sit daily, and to experiment with keeping the body motionless throughout the day (this was bringing more noticeable vibrations a couple months ago). (And, of course, to carry on with the self-enquiry continually.) I suppose I'm particularly looking for your thoughts on:
1. Are short sits of value
2. Is 24/7 practice of value
3. Does "cumulative time" (many short sits collectively) have value
4. The role of long sits
5. If a more intensive, 4 hr daily practice would be more effective
And after going over all this... what role "grace" plays on this path? This was something I get more from Teresa of Avila (and Evelyn Underhill in the final chapters of her tome of mysticism): they say these big attainments are "given" rather than "attained." So, I have been thinking of this idea as well, more recently.
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Hello, I'd like to offer my thoughts on a couple of things. These answers are based on my experience, so ymmv.
1. Are short sits of value - For me, for reaching deeper meditative states, the answer is not really. I find that I need to sit atleast 25 minutes or so to get to a deeper meditative state.
2. Is 24/7 practice of value - For me, this is a definite yes. Not only will this bring your alot of mundane happiness and intuition in your daily life (and spiritual happiness and intuition), it will strengthen your sitting meditation. You will be 'primed'
3. Does "cumulative time" (many short sits collectively) have value - IMO, you should practice 24/7 in daily life and do long sits, rather than many short sits collectively
4. The role of long sits - Important. I find that you need atleast 25 minutes to start to enter into deeper meditative states and for deeper meditative phenomena to start to occur
5. If a more intensive, 4 hr daily practice would be more effective - Perhaps, but once again, in my opinion, you should keep a balance in life. And I could see this negatively affecting the rest of your life, which could, in turn, negatively affect your meditation, resulting in the opposite of the desired result. Therefore, in my opinion, you should do sitting meditation at most for 2 hours a day, and also have a 24/7 practice. If you ever get to the point where this is producing many spiritual phenomena, then perhaps you'll want to drastically change the structure of your life in order to accommodate a more extreme spiritual commitment.
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Thanks, Intuition, for your thoughts. :)
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Well said, Intuition. However, in addition I also found beginning and ending every day with a long meditation sit of at least 1 hour, if not 2, worked for me.