Author Topic: research into recovery  (Read 5853 times)

Frederick

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research into recovery
« on: March 16, 2016, 01:23:25 AM »
Perhaps a bit off topic, but I do feel that alcohol/drug addiction is not a disease.

I get a lot of flack for this, and perhaps I'm wrong.

I just thought it was really easy to quit alcohol. One of the things that helped me quit was the _belief_ that it would be easy.

I wonder if I had the belief that it were a disease; it would probably be more difficult.

Wishing you well.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 01:57:04 PM by Jhanananda »

Jhanananda

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research into recovery
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2016, 03:03:40 AM »
Yes, follinge, I agree somewhat with what you are saying.  in fact this has been a criticism that I have had with AA for many years.  AA's premise is that addiction is a disease, and thus one can never have recovery.  I see this premise as a denial system within AA that holds it back from being more successful.  Considering that AA is only 5% effective, then we can see why it is 95% ineffective.

I recently found this video, which represents a novel recovery strategy, which actually supports the GWV model, but their model needs updating to do so.

Drugs Don’t Cause Addiction:

The premise of this video is that by improving the world one lives in, drug addictions go away, which means drugs are a symptom of a dysfunctional world, not a cause of addiction in and of themselves.

This happens to be consistent with the GWV recovery model; however, the GWV recovery model is not based upon superficial changes to the environment, which the video advocates, but is based upon teaching people to meditate deeply causes their addictions to go away.  And, by learning to meditate deeply one acquires contentment with in spite of how dysfunctional the world is.

It just so happens the GWV recovery model is also consistent with the Noble Eightfold Path; however, I have yet to read or meet, a Buddhist priest of meditation teacher who understands the Noble Eightfold Path sufficiently to understand how following it leads to addiction recovery.

The GWV recovery model depends upon cultivating jhana; whereas, Buddhist priests and meditation teachers reject jhana.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 03:12:18 AM by Jhanananda »
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Jhanananda

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2016, 01:53:14 PM »
Over the night I considered the many reports of the debauchery of the rich and famous, and the evidence of the debauchery of the rich and famous in history, as proof that just having an abundant life does not lead to sobriety, but the contrary.

Also, last night I thought that I had moved this split topic thread to recovery, but I guess not, so I just did
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 02:01:57 PM by Jhanananda »
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Michel

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2016, 05:48:34 PM »
Perhaps a bit off topic, but I do feel that alcohol/drug addiction is not a disease.

I just thought it was really easy to quit alcohol. One of the things that helped me quit was the _belief_ that it would be easy.

I also found that it was easy to stop alcohol. I had no withdrawal effects from it after years of very heavy drinking which led to cirrhosis of the liver. I wasn't sure what to expect regarding whether it would be easy or not to withdraw. However, I had a great deal of difficulty withdrawing from benzodiazepines. It nearly killed me, as I've explained elsewhere. So, some drugs cause physical dependency.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 05:51:02 PM by Michel »

Michel

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2016, 07:21:44 PM »
I recently found this video, which represents a novel recovery strategy, which actually supports the GWV model, but their model needs updating to do so.

Drugs Don’t Cause Addiction:

The premise of this video is that by improving the world one lives in, drug addictions go away, which means drugs are a symptom of a dysfunctional world, not a cause of addiction in and of themselves.

The video seems to suggest that withdrawal symptoms and physical dependency from drugs is some sort of psychological delusion, i.e., patients having had hip surgery have no withdrawal effects from opioids administered by hospitals, while addicts on the street do. I certainly think that drug induced physical dependency is for real based on my own direct experience. But I agree with the main premise of the video, that we live in a profoundly sick society, which is what drives addictive behavior.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 08:40:29 PM by Michel »

Jhanananda

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2016, 02:21:36 AM »
I think the video over simplifies the issues involved with addiction and recovery, but they do make a good point that a lot of people are put on opiods, for long periods of time for medical treatment, but never become dependent upon it.
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Frederick

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2016, 04:09:42 AM »
I failed to mention that I had read a book called _Romancing the Opiates_ which changed my mind about drug addition as well as my own recent quitting drinking with no problems.

Indeed, some drugs cause physical addiction. Alcohol, for example, can require hospitalization.

Opiates have been highly over-rated to how addictive they are. I wonder how much of this delusion makes it harder for addicts to quit. They have such an easy excuse!

I imagine that benzodiazapines must have a physical withdrawal as well.

Did you get off the benzos, Michel? Was it difficult mentally?

I just realized that I am really interested in hearing other people's self-recovery stories.

Usually, I find drug addict stories to be so boring but not when people quit on their own.

Michel

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2016, 01:00:03 PM »

I imagine that benzodiazapines must have a physical withdrawal as well.

Did you get off the benzos, Michel? Was it difficult mentally?

I had been taking benzos at high doses for some 20 years and had very severe withdrawal symptoms when I quit, which lasted for months. See wiki article on benzodiazepine_withdrawal_syndrome:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzodiazepine_withdrawal_syndrome

Jhanananda

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Re: research into recovery
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2016, 01:16:38 PM »
I just realized that I am really interested in hearing other people's self-recovery stories.

Usually, I find drug addict stories to be so boring but not when people quit on their own.

For me I knew intuitively that uppers and downers were addictive, and caused serious side effects, plus I was just not interested in them.  I was mostly addicted to smoking marijuana, and was a weekend psychedelic consumer.  I smoked roughly an ounce of good weed every day, which kept me in a state of lethargy. 

After about 6 months of deep meditation practice I found no need for marijuana or psychedelics.  So, I just quit them both, along with all of the other recreational drugs that I had been exploring, as well as alcohol, on my 21st birthday.

I had been taking benzos at high doses for some 20 years and had very severe withdrawal symptoms when I quit, which lasted for months. See wiki article on benzodiazepine_withdrawal_syndrome:

I am sorry to hear how difficult with drawing from benzodiazepine was for you.
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