State of Immaterial Domain through Sleep Meditation

[Naman]

I wanted to know of this state as what u guys wud define it as. Firstly let me tell u that I havent been able to reach this state through meditation yet cause i havent been practicing path of meditation. Except for the few times i cud reach where i seriously did concentrative meditation for 45 or so minutes.
So i wud efface into a domain where i feel, see nothing but im aware of myself as awareness or wtever u call it "the real self"? At times if, in sleep itself, i wish to go obe(assume an astral body), i have to go thru this state. I feel there is nothing beyond it to experience. Sometimes i switch back and forth into it thru astral body, when i focus back on my source (my real self , consciousness or awareness ) i feel the boundaries of astral body vanish into nothingness, its like withdrawing ur awareness even from the astral senses and remaining aware of urself only. Earlier i used to feel huge bliss when i wud enter this state, now it feels same always, even in meditation for that matter. No matter how deep meditation is, it feels same in terms of bliss. So what state of experience is this? is there something beyond this as well to experience in meditation?

[Jhanananda]

It was my experience that when I exceeded the 45 minute barrier to meditation that I began to go much deeper into the meditation experience.  So, it is reasonable to me to propose that you too learn to exceed the 45 minute barrier to meditation to see what you find.  Also, we have a whole thread on lucid dreaming and the OOBE at the link.

[Naman]

Thank you for your quick response. I always love that about you.

" So, it is reasonable to me to propose that you too exceeded the 45 minute barrier to meditation to see what you find."

I am planning on that for sure, but for now i start loosing crispness of meditation after 40, 45 mins. There has been times when i was sitting for more than an hour everyday two times or more but i felt that i was shifting into contemplative meditation rather than concentrative. So i have now discarded that practice altogether and restarted with pure concentration, which in time i will increase the duration of for sure.

[Jhanananda]

Good to know, rastogi97, that you are planning on increasing your meditation time.

I do feel compelled to point out an erroneous belief system that you have subscribed to, which is based upon a common translation error of the Pali Canon.  The term 'concentration' is a common mistranslation of the Sanskrit term 'samadhi' and the Pali term 'jhana.'  This mistranslation typically leads to erroneous meditation practice, which tends to lead nowhere.

The term 'concentration' applies to the 7th fold of the Noble Eightfold Path, where we develop skill in meditation practice (magga).

Whereas, the 8th fold of the Noble Eightfold Path is defined in the suttas with terms like the Sanskrit term 'samadhi' and the Pali term 'jhana.'  If we are to read a properly translated sutta in the Pali canon, then we will see that the Sanskrit term 'samadhi' and the Pali term 'jhana' refer to an altered state of consciousness, and is not just the practice of concentration. 

Understanding this critical distinction allows us to realize that the whole purpose of meditation practice is to develop an altered state of consciousness.  Understanding that the 8th fold of the Noble Eightfold Path is an altered state of consciousness allows us to have the expectation that long practice strategies lead to an altered state of consciousness, which means our meditation practice is  more likely to bare fruit, than a practice that is not thus informed.

It just so happens that these altered states of consciousness can often be preceded by an apparent loss of focus.  We here find that meditation sessions often oscillate, and by just sticking with the session, then we find greater depth is acquired.

[Naman]

I do understand that, but its been funny with me. I'd be having strong nimittas but these thots they keep coming, they wont totally subside. So after sitting for sometime mind starts giving in to thoughts and thats what i call losing crispness of meditation. Sometimes i'd just be sitting there without thoughts also, but nothing will happen for long time, no total absorption, so mind feels like getting up since there is nowhere left to go and nothing left to do.

[Jhanananda]

Finding the benefit from attending to a still mind, and the charisms just takes time.

[Naman]

True. I will get onto it. My leg starts killing me after 45 mins, i suppose it will take few more days to breach 1hr barrier.
Thanks for your support and replies though

[Jhanananda]

I found a daily yoga practice helps to reshape the body for floor sitting.  Also, I found working on my sitting situation to optimize it, helped me to break the 1/2 hour barrier.

[Naman]

Thanx working on it.

[Naman]

I found a daily yoga practice helps to reshape the body for floor sitting.  Also, I found working on my sitting situation to optimize it, helped me to break the 1/2 hour barrier.

Okay today i meditated for more than an hour. Made slight changes in posture... And then i remained in that 4th jhana experience for another 40 mins. It feels like nothing will happen after that haha but nonethless as u adviced i will keep sitting longer n longer in that state.  There was a time when i transitioned into 5th jhana in about 40 mins only perhaps i was meditating all day while "doing things". Just an update.

[Jhanananda]

What I find works is just savoring the stage that one is at, and sitting with that stage as long as one can, then the stages progress on their own.

[Naman]

Thats what i have realized ! I was getting up every time early cause i was expecting to reach the next level quickly but that was increasing the anxiety rather than bringing further relaxation. 
Thank you for pointing it out.

[Naman]

What I find works is just savoring the stage that one is at, and sitting with that stage as long as one can, then the stages progress on their own.

Hello, i now m sitting past the state where i feel no anxiety and where i feel i can sit as long as i want. It takes i think sometimes 20,30 even 40 mins to reach there. Then after that i m simply sitting in that for 1.5 or 2 hrs. I dont feel like getting up but i do cause of some work or cause of pain in leg. After getting up it still feels like im in that state and nothing has changed, even thoughts coming in mind doesnt lower that state so to speak. This is fourth jhana right? I do hear ringing all day long and i can feel tingling also if i allow that to happen (uncontrolled tingling electricity like sensations used to happen long back)

and yeah once on youtube u mentioned that it took you 6months to transcend 4th jhana and reach 5th one. So how long were u meditating those 6 months (perday).

Now im sitting more than 2 hrs , 2 times a day. Is it good enough ? :/ and yeah i do change my posture once or twice :| it feels like its not making any difference on meditative state, what do u think should i avoid doing that? Other than that i m sitting motionless.

[Jhanananda]

Hello, i now m sitting past the state where i feel no anxiety and where i feel i can sit as long as i want. It takes i think sometimes 20,30 even 40 mins to reach there. Then after that i m simply sitting in that for 1.5 or 2 hrs. I dont feel like getting up but i do cause of some work or cause of pain in leg. After getting up it still feels like im in that state and nothing has changed, even thoughts coming in mind doesnt lower that state so to speak. This is fourth jhana right?

It is consistent with my experience of a 4th level below the "normal" cognitive state, which I take is the 4th jhana.

I do hear ringing all day long and i can feel tingling also if i allow that to happen (uncontrolled tingling electricity like sensations used to happen long back)

If it is true that "we know a tree by its fruit,"  And, the "fruit" being referred to here are the charisms, then the fact that you are experiencing these charisms is proof that you have most certainly found some significant depth in your daily meditation practice.

and yeah once on youtube u mentioned that it took you 6months to transcend 4th jhana and reach 5th one. So how long were u meditating those 6 months (perday).

In those days I meditated at least 3 times per day, and often almost all day long in 1-2 hour intervals with breaks in between to work in my organic garden.

Now im sitting more than 2 hrs , 2 times a day. Is it good enough ? :/ and yeah i do change my posture once or twice :| it feels like its not making any difference on meditative state, what do u think should i avoid doing that? Other than that i m sitting motionless.

It is clear that you practice of two 2-hour meditation sessions per day is paying off quite well.  I have found that there is benefit from meditating more, if one can fit it in.  For me I found a maximum of 6 hours reaped benefit, after that my body started to experience joint and nerve pain.  So, I keep it to about 6 hours per day of meditation.

Yes, at the level of meditation that you and I, and many of the people on this forum practice, we find little difference between formal practice, and chopping wood, and carrying water, etc.  We can just keep our mindful, self-awareness, still mind, while attending to the charisms all day, even while engaged in the world.

Good work, and keep it up.

[Naman]

Thanks, I will keep it up and keep u posted of any advancements