Beginners Jhana

[jhananimitta]

Can someone please explain what one does in the first Jhana? I get absorbed into contact. I feel that I have tuned into one thought.

I can’t discern if I have joy or bliss as this state is very profound. Realizing that I have no breath or the feeling of no breath.
My breathing becomes erratic and the whole thing falls apart. Although I still have that profound state. Doubt arises which then turns to panic and I stop meditating.
Should I keep on with the feeling of profound state and forget about the no breathing and let go? Or maybe this has nothing to do with the first Jhana?

I have read the first Jhana and the 5 jhana factors. So can we compartmentalize the factors? Do these factors happen in one go when contact is made?

Vitakka - applied or initiating attention
Vicára - sustained attention
Sukha - joy
Piti -bliss
Ekaggatha - one-pointedness

It would be greatly appreciated if one can explain these simple factors to someone new to the first gate.   
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The answer to my question just needed some direction.

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/recognizingabsorption.htm



jhananimitta

For straight is the path and narrow is the gate

[Jhanananda]

Can someone please explain what one does in the first Jhana?

I define the first stage of depth in meditation, which I believe is the same as Siddhartha Gautama's first jhana, as just finding the practice of meditation enjoyable, and fulfilling in and of itself.  When we find meditation thus, then we want to practice every day, and we want to meditate several times a day, and we want our meditation sessions to be longer.

I get absorbed into contact. I feel that I have tuned into one thought.

I can’t discern if I have joy or bliss as this state is very profound. Realizing that I have no breath or the feeling of no breath.

When we learn to take our pleasure and fulfillment from the practice of meditation, then we practice meditation more and for longer periods.  It is here where we begin to have the experience of deep meditation.  We find here that when the breath seems to cease, then the subject is most likely at the 4th stage of depth in meditation (4th jhana).

My breathing becomes erratic and the whole thing falls apart. Although I still have that profound state. Doubt arises which then turns to panic and I stop meditating.
Should I keep on with the feeling of profound state and forget about the no breathing and let go? Or maybe this has nothing to do with the first Jhana?

It sounds like you are getting attached to your meditation object, which in your case is the breath.  When the breath appears to stop, then do not cling to it.  Just let happen what happens, and do accept the strange things that arise be the signs of deep meditation, which are called "jhana-nimitta" in the Pali Canon.

I have read the first Jhana and the 5 jhana factors. So can we compartmentalize the factors? Do these factors happen in one go when contact is made?

Vitakka - applied or initiating attention
Vicára - sustained attention
Sukha - joy
Piti -bliss
Ekaggatha - one-pointedness

It would be greatly appreciated if one can explain these simple factors to someone new to the first gate.   
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The answer to my question just needed some direction.

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/recognizingabsorption.htm

jhananimitta

For straight is the path and narrow is the gate

Yes, the factors are correct, but we just need to keep in mind that the 8 stages of depth in meditation (samadhi) do not start with a fantastic experience, but begin with the first discernible experience of depth, and move to greater levels of depth, which are characterized by increasingly profound states.  Typically the 3d to the 4th stages are so profound that they tend to blow the mind of the subject, and sometimes people get frightened by greater depth.

[jhananimitta]

Honesty when I read your answers I freaked out. The palms where sweaty and the heart was racing. I had to walk out side under the stars as I felt I was going to explode. Every fear mongering thought attacked my psyche. How could I have slipped that far in deep meditation. I thought this was a gradual process?

I really had to try hard to compose myself. As I felt I've gone too far and too quick. I panicked and started pacing. Thinking that it would ware off. I didn't. I needed an Ally which was my younger self. The younger me had been though a lot of strange, hurtful and experimental stages. So I asked. Whats the difference between what I was then and what I'm now? The only answer was time.

The panic and trembling stop and got replaced with warmness. I felt a calmness enter my being much like when I start deep meditation but not as intense. Then my mind climbed in to have another round. But this time it hit a brick wall. The problem arise when one gets caught in the moment with an unsettled mind which leads to fear and attachment. Its easy for me to say that now I admit. But I have come across that this unpleasantness is necessary.

So now when I re-read your comments. Its very claim with focused mind.

As I stated in our first email correspondence. I have come to understand how to cultivate the door to the inner mind. This is when I took up the practice again in earnest three mouths ago. The question that got me there was I wanted to understand God. Whether God was in the sky or just thin air. There must be something. So I practice. And dropped everything I knew about pretend meditation.

You are right that when I punched longer times in meditation "enjoyable, and fulfilling in and of itself". I wanted more meditation. All I could think about was meditation. The only subject I wanted to talk about was meditation.

The first time I experienced deep meditation it took me really quick to get there. The second time took me quicker and that is the base now. Since my last post I have stopped meditating. Purely from confutation and needed some guidance. I can see that I'm clinging to the breath and should "Just let happen what happens, and do accept the strange things that arise be the signs of deep meditation". I do however need to read up more about what the actual signs are versus jhana-nimitta. For jhana-nimitta is running in the foreground.

Is there a way I can traverse the Jhanas back down to the first Jhana? As you describe I might be going into the 4th Jhana or already in the 4th Jhana? I feel I need solid foundation or become skillfull before I blow my mind...

As always I'm grateful deeply for the free time that you have spent writing to this post.

[Jhanananda]

Honesty when I read your answers I freaked out. The palms where sweaty and the heart was racing. I had to walk out side under the stars as I felt I was going to explode. Every fear mongering thought attacked my psyche. How could I have slipped that far in deep meditation. I thought this was a gradual process?

For most people the process of progressing to deeper depths in meditation is a gradual process; however, for those who have joined this forum often we find fairly profound states within the first few weeks of taking up a daily meditation practice.  This rapid progress tends to confuse some people.

I really had to try hard to compose myself. As I felt I've gone too far and too quick. I panicked and started pacing. Thinking that it would ware off. I didn't. I needed an Ally which was my younger self. The younger me had been though a lot of strange, hurtful and experimental stages. So I asked. Whats the difference between what I was then and what I'm now? The only answer was time.

The panic and trembling stop and got replaced with warmness. I felt a calmness enter my being much like when I start deep meditation but not as intense. Then my mind climbed in to have another round. But this time it hit a brick wall. The problem arise when one gets caught in the moment with an unsettled mind which leads to fear and attachment. Its easy for me to say that now I admit. But I have come across that this unpleasantness is necessary.

This reminds me of the reference to 'aridity' in John of the Cross's books.  We all have to realize that there are ups and downs in the contemplative life for all of us.  If we meditate daily to depth, and we do it for decades, then we get used to the ups and downs, and the ups and downs become a gentle ride through hilly country, instead of a roller coaster ride.

So now when I re-read your comments. Its very claim with focused mind.

As I stated in our first email correspondence. I have come to understand how to cultivate the door to the inner mind. This is when I took up the practice again in earnest three mouths ago. The question that got me there was I wanted to understand God. Whether God was in the sky or just thin air. There must be something. So I practice. And dropped everything I knew about pretend meditation.

When we examine the references to "holy spirit" in the Bible and Gospels, and compare that to the references to samadhi in the Pali Canon and Yoga Sutras, then I find these terms are used synonymously.  So, the experience of depth in meditation is one and the same with the experience of direct communion with god as described in the Bible and Gospels.

You are right that when I punched longer times in meditation "enjoyable, and fulfilling in and of itself". I wanted more meditation. All I could think about was meditation. The only subject I wanted to talk about was meditation.

The first time I experienced deep meditation it took me really quick to get there. The second time took me quicker and that is the base now. Since my last post I have stopped meditating. Purely from confutation and needed some guidance. I can see that I'm clinging to the breath and should "Just let happen what happens, and do accept the strange things that arise be the signs of deep meditation". I do however need to read up more about what the actual signs are versus jhana-nimitta. For jhana-nimitta is running in the foreground.

Is there a way I can traverse the Jhanas back down to the first Jhana? As you describe I might be going into the 4th Jhana or already in the 4th Jhana? I feel I need solid foundation or become skillfull before I blow my mind...

As always I'm grateful deeply for the free time that you have spent writing to this post.

When the experience of deep meditation gets scary, then just open your eyes and get up and go for a walk, or go about your day.  It is that simple.  Eventually one will become used to the terrain of deep meditation, then one can explore greater depth when one is ready.

[jhananimitta]

All things come to those who practice skillfully.

And this is what I have been doing these past weeks. I have managed to start from the beginning with the process to dial in and fine tune the experiences. Although it was hard at first as, the mind was not wanting to be still. Racing around like ponies do in the field.

When I succeed in achieving the first gate (Jhana) I was joyful and blissfully contented. I knew that the other gates where in reach. I'm currently dipping in and out of the fourth gate and I find that this one is going to take me awhile. Its very profound and when I get contact I see swirling patterns forming. Very bright colored patterns something like a kaleidoscope. I have also heard two very low tones running in parallel. Each taking turns in adjusting the audio with degrees.

These experiences have changed my life dramatically and sometimes, I have had hard times dealing with people and there ways. At some points I feel that I could just vanish and live a solitude life.

[Jhanananda]

Its very profound and when I get contact I see swirling patterns forming. Very bright colored patterns something like a kaleidoscope. I have also heard two very low tones running in parallel. Each taking turns in adjusting the audio with degrees.

These, I believe are what is referred to in the suttas as jhananimitta.  I have found if I just tune my meditation to the jhananimitta, then I find they are the pathway to greater depth in meditation.  It sounds like you are finding the same thing.

These experiences have changed my life dramatically and sometimes, I have had hard times dealing with people and there ways. At some points I feel that I could just vanish and live a solitude life.

Yes, I too found the more time I spend in deep meditation the more my life is transformed, and the less the things of life attract me.

[jhananimitta]

I have extended my sitting more frequently to two or three times a day (depends on circumstance). During the days I feel electric but when it comes to sitting. I feel slightly anxious half an hour before. Can't work out why?

I find the experience of bliss or body hit lasts very sort (5 mins or so) and the jhananimitta don't come or the signs shows up and disappear. That is when my meditation stops or I have to revive it from the beginning. Usually at this point its hard to maintain focus on my object. If I can't maintain I don't mess around and force myself. I just stop.

I have tried working out what has changed and hopefully it will iron itself out in the end. 

[Jhanananda]

It sounds like you are making progress.  Success in deep meditation just takes time, patience, and continuity.

[jhananimitta]

I did the ironing and found the issue I was having and fixed it.

I'm technical and that got in the way. I never understood how I arrived at deep meditation except that I would just fall into it. I had the technique down to the letter. But when I applied critical thinking at how I actually arrived. It all went out the window.

The feelings of anxiousness is the immutable current state moving to the mutable.

A few answers would be helpful from your own experience. I'm sure you have written about this?

Why do we get absorbed in deep meditation?
Do we have these states when we sleep but unaware that its taking place?
Why does one feel bliss?

[Jhanananda]

I did the ironing and found the issue I was having and fixed it.

I'm technical and that got in the way. I never understood how I arrived at deep meditation except that I would just fall into it. I had the technique down to the letter. But when I applied critical thinking at how I actually arrived. It all went out the window.

I arrived at deep meditation shortly after I started daily meditation practice.  I reason why is because I expected that meditation practice would lead to something pleasant, and an altered state of consciousness.

It is also possible that those who arrive at deep meditation have exceptional IQs, as I do, and it seems that you do, and it seems most of the people on this forum seem to.

The feelings of anxiousness is the immutable current state moving to the mutable.

I noticed that as I meditated deeply that I would become aware of the mental state of others.  I happened to find it easier to meditate deeply when in the wilderness, so I went on hikes nearly every day, as everywhere in Tucson is only about 20 minutes from a hiking trail.  I also spent at least 2 weeks camping in the wilderness every year, as well as I attended at least one 10-day meditation retreat each year.  So, I developed skill with deep meditation, and self-awareness. 

There were times when I felt anxious.  When I examined myself I could not see a reason for the anxiety and determined that I was becoming aware of others around me who are anxious.  And, 13 years ago when I increased my meditation practice I headed off into the wilderness where I would not feel the anxiety of others. So, since you are meditating deeply, then possibly the anxiety that you feel is the anxiety that other around you feel.

A few answers would be helpful from your own experience. I'm sure you have written about this?

Why do we get absorbed in deep meditation?

It is a natural state that some people who are more intelligent than others discover on their own when they take up a contemplative life.

Do we have these states when we sleep but unaware that its taking place?

We can.  I have, but most people do not, because they do not lead a contemplative life.

Why does one feel bliss?

It is simply part of the experience of deep meditation.  Also, if it was not blissful, then it would not be compelling enough to pursue deep meditation, as well as put up with the strange charisms, as well as the spiritual crises that are part and parcel of an interior life that goes to depth.

[jhananimitta]

I noticed that as I meditated deeply that I would become aware of the mental state of others

Yes I find this too. But as I can't read minds I do feel the knots tied deeply in their minds.

I happened to find it easier to meditate deeply when in the wilderness, so I went on hikes nearly every day, as everywhere in Tucson is only about 20 minutes from a hiking trail.  I also spent at least 2 weeks camping in the wilderness every year, as well as I attended at least one 10-day meditation retreat each year.  So, I developed skill with deep meditation, and self-awareness. 

I have never attended a meditation retreat and feel that's not for me. As I'm a solitary person only venturing out from my space when necessary.

There were times when I felt anxious. When I examined myself I could not see a reason for the anxiety and determined that I was becoming aware of others around me who are anxious.

I agree with this and the only conclusion was the transformation in myself. I have also been absorbed in the meditation state when fully awake. i.e. not trying to meditate at all. Would you call this being saturated?

In sitting I also experience the loss of time when it feels like I have been meditating for twenty minutes when, actually its been close to 2 hours. Recently my deep meditation pattern has changed. I get absorbed one night and the next two nights I'm bordering around being absorbed. This feels at the moment enough as the absorption spills over to my normal state of being. Until the cycle starts again.
 

 

[Jhanananda]

I agree with this and the only conclusion was the transformation in myself. I have also been absorbed in the meditation state when fully awake. i.e. not trying to meditate at all. Would you call this being saturated?

Yes, that is the consensus here, because we who meditate deeply consistently tend to find the charisms are with us throughout the day.

In sitting I also experience the loss of time when it feels like I have been meditating for twenty minutes when, actually its been close to 2 hours.

Space/time dilation is a characteristic of the fourth stage of depth in meditation (4th jhana).

Recently my deep meditation pattern has changed. I get absorbed one night and the next two nights I'm bordering around being absorbed. This feels at the moment enough as the absorption spills over to my normal state of being. Until the cycle starts again.

It is a common experience for those who meditate deeply that there are waves or cycles to the depth.  We just get used to it, but show up regularly in case the rocket ship ride to the center of the universe shows up to.  Otherwise we might miss the ride.

[Frederick]

Hey, I know you're not one for retreats, but I'd love to meet you.

Another guy that came for a retreat, Zach was really great.

The retreats are low pressure, not like the boot camp that I expected.

Anyway, no pressure. It's lovely to read your posts. Very inspirational.

[Frederick]

Jeffrey, I just put 2 and 2 together about anxiety.

When we're camping together, do you feel my anxiety? If so, thanks for making the sacrifice.

Overall, I'm just curious. I figured if if bothered you too much, you'd do something about it. But it was just something that I wondered about while re-reading this thread.

Be well.

[jhananimitta]

Hey, I know you're not one for retreats, but I'd love to meet you.

I have thought about it after I posted my comment. But it will take some planing to get there.