Author Topic: Choice and the Divine  (Read 6177 times)

jay.validus

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Choice and the Divine
« on: April 11, 2015, 09:45:28 PM »
This is something that has taken me all my life so far to figure out. I have found this to be true of others as well.  This is the person who is deep within their subconscious, and is experiencing lots of energy and other altered states of consciousness.  The person in this position tends to trust completely in this divine power, and believes you do not need to work, worry about feeding oneself, etc.  I get it, I have been there LOTS and still have that daily occurrence.

But I finally realized in the past few months -- I have a choice.  I have my own will and volition, my own mind to discern the world.  Wow. I feel more complete than I have my entire life, and all I am is being me!
« Last Edit: April 14, 2015, 10:27:20 PM by jay.validus »

Jhanananda

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2015, 01:51:59 PM »
But I finally realized in the past few months -- I have a choice.  I have my own will and volition, my own mind to discern the world.  Wow. I feel more complete than I have my entire life, and I am is being me!
More than 40 years ago I had stumbled upon deep meditation with no instruction at all.  At that time I believed that if one had genuine spiritual attainment that "God" would provide for one.  Well, no spiritual entity provided for me, so I developed a career that did not impinge upon my contemplative life.  It sounds like you have come to the same realization.  Good work.
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Alexander

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2015, 02:07:11 PM »
Quote from: Luke 22:35-36
Then Jesus asked them, "When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?" "Nothing," they answered. He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one."

We need to mortify our wills to get anywhere in the spiritual life: but, after we have done that, there comes a time when we can again rely on ourselves and not on providence.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 02:44:11 PM by Alexander »
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Jhanananda

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2015, 01:47:02 PM »
Yes, I agree, Alexander.  There is a time for giving up everything to lead a contemplative life.  Once we have honed our contemplative life, so that it bares fruit, then we can take up an occupation, to further our spiritual mission, if we so choose.  This is what I have done.
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Anatta

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2015, 04:54:09 PM »
I identify with your insight.  My former self before awakening involved work in marketing communications; i.e., manipulation of the ego to get people to spend money on something they might not otherwise purchase.  Outright lying was encouraged, and resistance always acquiesced into a compromise of subtle manipulation of "truth."  It only fed the world, and my own ego, in negative ways.  My new careers I've had during/after awakening involve using the same skills I have with people and discerning emotions, but not to manipulate -- only to assist them to find their own way; to hold space for them without ego.  I'm not always perfect.  Concepts of right livelihood and right effort help me when I fall down, as does honest discourse with those whom were hurt when I do.

Right livelihood seems to be about feeding the self so that it can continue to practice, and in turn, perhaps help others to do so.
 
I also like the concept (a Zen practice?) of leaving a little something after a meal on the table when I leave to clear my plate as an offering for the Hungry Ghost.  It fosters compassion further while receiving bounty that a livelihood affords.  And reminds me that there are people out there who do not, for various reasons, fit into this world in a way that enables them to practice right livelihood.  That they are a part of who we are as well, and need nourishment too, if we can find a way.

Jhanananda

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2015, 02:00:45 AM »
Right livelihood seems to be about feeding the self so that it can continue to practice, and in turn, perhaps help others to do so.enables them to practice right livelihood. 
This seems like a reasonably good summary to me.
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jay.validus

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2015, 10:26:12 PM »
The next difficult thing to figure out is, in your words, how to live a contemplative life in the world.  The answer is different for each person.  Most people will not understand a more mystical-type person saying they need their lives to be centred on the divine.  How do you explain that?  How you do describe the depth of your experience to them, as it unfolds every moment?

These are rhetorical questions, but nonetheless, current real world obstacles I am pondering.  It is not easy for anyone of us.

Jhanananda

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Re: Choice and the Divine
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2015, 02:23:55 AM »
The next difficult thing to figure out is, in your words, how to live a contemplative life in the world.  The answer is different for each person.  Most people will not understand a more mystical-type person saying they need their lives to be centred on the divine.  How do you explain that?  How you do describe the depth of your experience to them, as it unfolds every moment?

These are rhetorical questions, but nonetheless, current real world obstacles I am pondering.  It is not easy for anyone of us.
I agree, jay, it can be very difficult to express the experience of deep meditation to the rest of the world.  This is in part why I chose to work with people who are already meditating deeply.  However, I can see why others would choose just to disappear into the wilderness and never be heard from again.
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