Striking a deal with the muses -- sharing more experiences

[jay.validus]

Hello! I realize this topic might be moved, not sure where to place things yet.

After reading more posts on this forum, and finding it helpful in comparison to my experience, I thought I would expand a little on my own experience and share a few more of my thoughts.

In my meditations, when I contemplate, and in life in general, I enjoy keeping my mind at a deep level.  This is where I am at the vast majority of the time. It can get very intense sometimes.  Mostly, it a mild peace and joy, and usually it accompanied by emptiness.  Sometimes that emptiness can become very intense, and I have noticed this is when my dreams become lucid.   Other times emptiness can bring out much deep things to the surface, and then that becomes very difficult to handle. However, mostly I live happy and smiling all the time.

One of my most helpful insights was, "These two seemingly opposing things can co-exist together within me, why not?"  This has really brought more understanding of myself and others, and also brought lots of peace.  I don't feel the need to figure out everything.  If two people can have two different opinions, why can't those two opinions be within me?  I can hold both, what is stopping me, really?

Since a young kid, I always enjoyed watching within myself how stuff manifests in my mind.  I enjoyed the content, usually about the other-world, God, spirit, meaning of life, purpose, and then how these interrelate to our worldly level.  I did not realize how deep I kept myself until the past couple years, when a friend told me I am too deep (I don't chill with him anymore).  I have an outgoing personality too, so I got a good balance going.

When talking about the creative force, I find there are a few parts of me coming to the forefront.  One is one slice of me, that really does not desire anything.  Nothing worldly, divine, but just to be.  This is my general personality anyway.  There has been a contention when the voice comes and speaks, "What do you want?".  What do you want?  I never have an answer to the question, but that acceptance attitude has been a major downfall for me.

This brings me to the creative force.  I have a friend, with whom we both are on similar wavelengths spiritually.  We were talking about the creative force, and he said for those who are artists and are really in tune will eventually have to strike a deal with the muses.  Otherwise, you risk having the energy overload and overpower you.  You go crazy.   I have experienced a few of those psychotic moments because of the divine energy and changes in awareness, due to the intensity and loss of self.

What is the purpose of this creative force?  To create, okay.  But this creates a very real dilemma for me.  If I do not desire anything at deep levels of my mind, only to surrender, but I can allow the creative force to work through me, then why do I not?  It is easy to live a live of acceptance, having faith in God or the higher being, but another to really unfold as one likes.  Part of being human is the free will to make our own choices, our own survival.  This is part of our being.  Why not embrace it?

In the past year, I am slowly coming to realize my acceptance attitude has been a hindrance to me in my meditations. I used to let what arose to arise as pass without any control in the manner.  But, I have a choice to direct my thoughts, like a steam boat I steer in many different directions.   There are times when acceptance and surrender has its place, but I find directing the thoughts and the mind does have a role as well, depending on the circumstances.

There are my hopes and dreams. Lately, I finally started to wonder, where do they come from? Where is the stem?  Where is the root?  Which parts of the mind are they connected to and for what purpose?  What role is greed, love, fear, ego, delusion, the "personalities" etc, all of their roles?  What is really there, and then what is not there?

I understand the destructive nature of this energy.  I have read from others on this forum there is a fear.  I am scared too.  This fear this this "path" will become my entire life.  I will leave society and dedicate myself to this 'noble' path.  I am scared, yet it has been one of the sole focuses of my life thus far.  It is like my life has been predetermined, but I am choosing it freely as I go along.  But, when I get down to it, I am a pretty happy guy, so I just go one day at a time.

Jay

[Jhanananda]

Good to hear from you Jay.  It sounds like your discussion here is related to insight, but we can see how it progresses.  For right now your use of the term "muse" might be best investigated.

The Muses (Ancient Greek: Μοῦσαι Mousai; perhaps from the o-grade of the Proto-Indo-European root *men- "think")[1] in Greek mythology, poetry and literature, are the goddesses of the inspiration of literature, science, and the arts. They were considered the source of the knowledge, related orally for centuries in the ancient culture, which was contained in poetic lyrics and myths.

The Muses, the personification of knowledge and the arts, especially literature, dance and music, are the nine daughters of Zeus and Mnemosyne (who was memory personified). Sometimes they are referred to as water nymphs, associated with the springs of Helicon and with Pieris. According to Pausanias in the later 2nd century AD,[2] there were three original Muses, worshiped on Mount Helicon in Boeotia. In later tradition, four Muses were recognised: Thelxinoë, Aoedē, Arche, and Meletē, said to be daughters of Zeus and Plusia or of Uranus.

The Muses were both the embodiments and sponsors of performed metrical speech: mousike (hence the English term "music") was just "one of the arts of the Muses". Others included Science, Geography, Mathematics, Philosophy, and especially Art, Drama, and inspiration. Some authors invoke Muses when writing poetry, hymns or epic history. The invocation typically occurs at or near the beginning, and calls for help or inspiration, or simply invites the Muse to sing through the author.

[jay.validus]

Good to hear from you Jay.  It sounds like your discussion here is related to insight, but we can see how it progresses.  For right now your use of the term "muse" might be best investigated.

The Muses (Ancient Greek: Μοῦσαι Mousai; perhaps from the o-grade of the Proto-Indo-European root *men- "think")[1] in Greek mythology, poetry and literature, are the goddesses of the inspiration of literature, science, and the arts. They were considered the source of the knowledge, related orally for centuries in the ancient culture, which was contained in poetic lyrics and myths.

The Muses, the personification of knowledge and the arts, especially literature, dance and music, are the nine daughters of Zeus and Mnemosyne (who was memory personified). Sometimes they are referred to as water nymphs, associated with the springs of Helicon and with Pieris. According to Pausanias in the later 2nd century AD,[2] there were three original Muses, worshiped on Mount Helicon in Boeotia. In later tradition, four Muses were recognised: Thelxinoë, Aoedē, Arche, and Meletē, said to be daughters of Zeus and Plusia or of Uranus.

The Muses were both the embodiments and sponsors of performed metrical speech: mousike (hence the English term "music") was just "one of the arts of the Muses". Others included Science, Geography, Mathematics, Philosophy, and especially Art, Drama, and inspiration. Some authors invoke Muses when writing poetry, hymns or epic history. The invocation typically occurs at or near the beginning, and calls for help or inspiration, or simply invites the Muse to sing through the author.

Maybe muse was not the best word, but the use of these Gods as personification of the creative force works for me. I am personally more interested in how the creative forces unravel place within the deep parts & the surface of the (my) mind; that I do not have an answer for myself yet.  I can see it being related to insight, but on another level it is not.  How can you define something which comes from nothing?  It comes, it manifests, then leaves.  I see the insight connection, but before the manifestation there is a whole glob of something happening in nothing.

[jay.validus]

To be honest, I think this post deserves a different title, as my intention was more to give some more of my experiences, which might be of interest to someone in the same way I found others experiences helpful to read/hear.

[Jhanananda]

Maybe muse was not the best word, but the use of these Gods as personification of the creative force works for me. I am personally more interested in how the creative forces unravel place within the deep parts & the surface of the (my) mind; that I do not have an answer for myself yet.  I can see it being related to insight, but on another level it is not.  How can you define something which comes from nothing?  It comes, it manifests, then leaves.  I see the insight connection, but before the manifestation there is a whole glob of something happening in nothing.

As a poly-math, like my grandfather.  I am an artist, an engineer, and a scientist, like my grandfather, so inspiration, or genius, for us comes in different ways, but regularly.  So, for me I do not see that my interests come from external spiritual forces, like the Greek concept of the muses; and I have never propitiated them.  To me my genius is all the product of intuitive, revelatory insight, which means anyone who leads a contemplative life style that cultivates deep meditation states can acquire intuitive, revelatory insight and the other superior fruit (maha-phala) of spiritual attainments.

To be honest, I think this post deserves a different title, as my intention was more to give some more of my experiences, which might be of interest to someone in the same way I found others experiences helpful to read/hear.

I am not yet convinced that your title needs to be changed; however, I could see moving this topic to the insight section.  So, I will do so.

[jay.validus]

Maybe muse was not the best word, but the use of these Gods as personification of the creative force works for me. I am personally more interested in how the creative forces unravel place within the deep parts & the surface of the (my) mind; that I do not have an answer for myself yet.  I can see it being related to insight, but on another level it is not.  How can you define something which comes from nothing?  It comes, it manifests, then leaves.  I see the insight connection, but before the manifestation there is a whole glob of something happening in nothing.

As a poly-math, like my grandfather.  I am an artist, an engineer, and a scientist, like my grandfather, so inspiration, or genius, for us comes in different ways, but regularly.  So, for me I do not see that my interests come from external spiritual forces, like the Greek concept of the muses; and I have never propitiated them.  To me my genius is all the product of intuitive, revelatory insight, which means anyone who leads a contemplative life style that cultivates deep meditation states can acquire intuitive, revelatory insight and the other superior fruit (maha-phala) of spiritual attainments.

I see the creative force as something internal within all of us.  For me, what I am examining is the emptiness, and seeing where the insight comes and why.  What were the factors that brought this insight to this situation?  Why here and why now?

If I examine the creative force as something internal, I could classify one as having a sense of self and then something beyond that.  Right now, I am thinking whatever internal is beyond the sense of self (get it?), that force or power can exist beyond just mere intuition and insight. I suppose you could call it channelling.  But then, I could see your opinion too, channelling is insight in action.

Watching it play out is far more interesting than talking about it haha.