Cal's Meditation and Mystical Experience Records

[Cal]

Yes, I find the suttas are quite clear that the 4 jhanas are the path to liberation; and we are confirmed in that premise by the fact that those who find the OOBE, and/or direct their effort toward them do not seem to be free of obsessive and compulsive behavior, such as addictions. So, I agree there is not much point in putting a lot of emphasis in cultivating them; however, it has been my experience, and my case histories support this conclusion, that those who learn to meditate to the depth of the 4 jhanas tend to spontaneously develop the OOBE; and since we had recent discussion on remote viewing, then remote viewing is also develop spontaneously for those who learn to meditate deeply.

So the OOBE is "ok", and remote viewing is "ok"? They will happen, and the fact that they do, is "ok"?

Devaputra Mara-The mara of seeking pleasure
Klesha Mara-The mara of using emotions for escape
Yama Mara-The mara of the fear of death

I've put a great deal of effort into changing or directing my own perspective. I've come across these terms, and since they are of Buddhist concept, I've been trying to use them in organizing my thoughts towards their correspondence. Rather than my previous method of identifying negative (becoming aware, naming, and letting it fall) I've started trying to visualize them as a manifest demon. In my mind, I feel that allowing this visualization will bring them to light, and may even possibly skew my subconscious mind, or spirit into creating a clear threshold in which to observe them. I hate to think of the subconscious mind as not of that of my own, or to empower the mind of the body. But, I know in doing so that my dreams and perception of the OOBE could lead to direct conflict with these manifest demons of fears. and desires. It's all I could come up with in creating this threshold. Its exhausting. It almost seems easier to stumble upon them. If there was a way that I could eliminate all of this damned "training". I wish I were a child, unburdened by society and their damned maddening thoughts that lead them blindly to NOTHING! And yet, the mind of the child is the closest thing I could compare to what I need to do. Or do I? Direction has become utterly unclear lately...I only know that I wish to break these fucking chains that bind me.

[Jhanananda]

So the OOBE is "ok", and remote viewing is "ok"? They will happen, and the fact that they do, is "ok"?

Yes, in my experience they are simply some of the superior fruit of attainment for those who learn to meditate deeply.

Devaputra Mara-The mara of seeking pleasure
Klesha Mara-The mara of using emotions for escape
Yama Mara-The mara of the fear of death

I've put a great deal of effort into changing or directing my own perspective. I've come across these terms, and since they are of Buddhist concept, I've been trying to use them in organizing my thoughts towards their correspondence. Rather than my previous method of identifying negative (becoming aware, naming, and letting it fall) I've started trying to visualize them as a manifest demon. In my mind, I feel that allowing this visualization will bring them to light, and may even possibly skew my subconscious mind, or spirit into creating a clear threshold in which to observe them. I hate to think of the subconscious mind as not of that of my own, or to empower the mind of the body. But, I know in doing so that my dreams and perception of the OOBE could lead to direct conflict with these manifest demons of fears. and desires. It's all I could come up with in creating this threshold. Its exhausting. It almost seems easier to stumble upon them. If there was a way that I could eliminate all of this damned "training". I wish I were a child, unburdened by society and their damned maddening thoughts that lead them blindly to NOTHING! And yet, the mind of the child is the closest thing I could compare to what I need to do. Or do I? Direction has become utterly unclear lately...I only know that I wish to break these fucking chains that bind me.

Breaking the "chains" of social programming is part of the liberation experience.  We get there by following the whole of the Noble Eight-fold Path, which includes cultivating the 8 stages of depth in meditation (samadhi).  So, keep moving forward.  You are doing fine.

[Cal]

I began to remove the visual layer of this reality and the golden hue of the divine comes into view. The shapes dance and form a circle, and it fleets away inviting. A darkness comes and with it a new reality must be pierced. The golden shapes return, obscured by the darkness. It becomes harder to be at peace, more surrender is required. I dance with this darkness in victory and defeat. I become intent to show this darkness the light. No longer shall it see the golden, but the white. I dance with this darkness in victory and defeat. The darkness has now become two. Feelings of joy arise, as now there are two that might accompany to this place of brilliance. The white breaks through, ever dancing upon the darkest darkness. It does not like this place of white, but there it shall return upon our next meeting. Another darkness comes, but piercing through becomes easier, there is a more brilliant light in the distance. But the world has called, and I must return. Until next time darkness, I will no longer accept being your prisoner, if attached you must be, then the light we will see together.

 

[Jhanananda]

Good metaphor, Cal. The images are basically shadows upon the light.  So, if the mystic just attends to the light, and ignores the shadows, then there will be no distractions, and no demons.

[Cal]

My visual field is primarily dark, with some light. Like the sun bursting through a dark cloud. Once I've absorbed though, large and small "sprites" can dance over the view screen, then it is primarily light. I've noticed two different types of meditation. When i meditate during the day, its as a grey visual field, and light can burst through dance around, make shapes, but eventually forms a kasina and takes off. After this, the backdrop gets dark and I must find the light again, this goes further and further. But at night, it is primarily the sprites, and I have very seldom seen the kasina. However, the pull on my spirit seems more intense. Like the separation of body and spirit starts to happen almost immediately. It's such a weird feeling lol. Last night I lie in meditation for hours. I kept popping out of the body, sitting up, looking around, and then going back in. Theres like this hum that happens, I see it in the visual field when I am separating. I can't even really explain it haha. I did notice though, that due to my own lack of diligence, that when it came to stop my breath, my stinking ears would twitch and i could freak out. The times that I did pop out for a second were the times that i lost consciousness and just woke up, already out. I've just been absolutely ecstatic the last 2 days. Those fuckers have no hold on me, but theyre still there. Maybe I'll throw them around a bit, see if they'll leave me alone lol. Theres this one, hes like a minotaur. That fucker is especially mean lol. Im gonna give him a big hug, then maybe body slam him lol.

[Jhanananda]

Some time ago I realized that pushing something away was the same as clutching at it.  Now, I just sit in meditation with a still mind.  When I close my eyes I see light, as if it were day time.

[Cal]

Some time ago I realized that pushing something away was the same as clutching at it.  Now, I just sit in meditation with a still mind.  When I close my eyes I see light, as if it were day time.

In the moment that I wrote that I was recalling all the nasty things that I had experienced. I agree with you here, and I do view the same way. Any kind of action becomes an interaction. Thank you for your guidance here, it is very helpful.

It makes me think of all of the benefits a GWV retreat center could bring. That a shared, collective space for us here could completely change everything.

Im thinking of a most recent post from you, that the immaterial domains can be experienced as a collective delusion. The dream space is that of the dreamers, and they make it. It makes sense to me, albeit confusing to be encountered. However, the importance of proper guidance becomes much more clear. Otherwise, I know personally, I would be caught in the web of dreams, believing them to be something entirely different.

I also think to things shared from both Bodhimind and Jhanon, that group meditations propel the entire group. A space in which we could be "collective" to me is of immeasurable value. I imagine a place that could be forever unknown to us, without this collective guidance. That we might discern things together, is paramount.

[Jhanananda]

...It makes me think of all of the benefits a GWV retreat center could bring. That a shared, collective space for us here could completely change everything.

Im thinking of a most recent post from you, that the immaterial domains can be experienced as a collective delusion. The dream space is that of the dreamers, and they make it. It makes sense to me, albeit confusing to be encountered. However, the importance of proper guidance becomes much more clear. Otherwise, I know personally, I would be caught in the web of dreams, believing them to be something entirely different.

I also think to things shared from both Bodhimind and Jhanon, that group meditations propel the entire group. A space in which we could be "collective" to me is of immeasurable value. I imagine a place that could be forever unknown to us, without this collective guidance. That we might discern things together, is paramount.

Yes, so true, so true.

[Cal]

I'm thinking  back to the few times I have been lucid before leaving the body. This one image keeps coming to mind. It was a picture of my mother, my sister and I. It caught fire in the left upper-most corner burning away the face of my mother and sister, but my own face remained. Many times I have thought on this, but never have I put any emphasis on it; I only knew it happened immediately before leaving the body. Now I am left with a "feeling" that it may have been symbolic, perhaps even guidance.

Too often do I find myself questioning why I continually submit to this bombardment from them (my family). It is no longer my mother or sister that I am concerned with, as they are very distant, my mother deceased even, but rather my wife and daughter. I despise that I think this way, and that feels un-natural. I make attempts to remind myself that a house-holder might find freedom, that even the worst off attachments are possible to navigate. I love my daughter so much, she is not a burden in anyway, yet she is a child of the world; her mother sees to this. I do not think that I can help them, and that was always a reason for staying. Maybe i just don't want to be alone.

I went for meditation this afternoon without any idea as to why I was feeling frustration, only that it was there. I sat in meditation for almost 2 and a half hours. Within probably 5 minutes into the sit I was already in the 4th Jhana viewing golden shapes disappearing behind a blue-fire back drop. I must have stayed right there for a long time before falling asleep to be woken up what seemed like only a few minutes later by my daughter. I looked at teh clock and it had been 2 and a half hours.

Now as I sat there collecting myself with abnormally loud ringing in my ears, my vision vibrating as if being shook by an earthquake, body lit up as if it was on fire, saturated in bliss; this bombardment of images came flooding into my mind. They came so fast and so many, it was like a VHS playback x 100. I have no idea what all of them were, and the above is the feeling I was left with.

Oddly, I am calmer, but this body feels as though it could cry.

[Jhanananda]

I'm thinking  back to the few times I have been lucid before leaving the body. This one image keeps coming to mind. It was a picture of my mother, my sister and I. It caught fire in the left upper-most corner burning away the face of my mother and sister, but my own face remained. Many times I have thought on this, but never have I put any emphasis on it; I only knew it happened immediately before leaving the body. Now I am left with a "feeling" that it may have been symbolic, perhaps even guidance.

This sounds symbolic of burning away your attachments to you family of origin, who are often the source of a great deal of pain.

Too often do I find myself questioning why I continually submit to this bombardment from them (my family). It is no longer my mother or sister that I am concerned with, as they are very distant, my mother deceased even, but rather my wife and daughter. I despise that I think this way, and that feels un-natural. I make attempts to remind myself that a house-holder might find freedom, that even the worst off attachments are possible to navigate. I love my daughter so much, she is not a burden in anyway, yet she is a child of the world; her mother sees to this. I do not think that I can help them, and that was always a reason for staying. Maybe i just don't want to be alone.

I have noticed that men often marry someone who resembles their mother, and women often marry someone who resembles their father.

I went for meditation this afternoon without any idea as to why I was feeling frustration, only that it was there. I sat in meditation for almost 2 and a half hours. Within probably 5 minutes into the sit I was already in the 4th Jhana viewing golden shapes disappearing behind a blue-fire back drop. I must have stayed right there for a long time before falling asleep to be woken up what seemed like only a few minutes later by my daughter. I looked at teh clock and it had been 2 and a half hours.

This is truly an example of 4th jhana attainment.

Now as I sat there collecting myself with abnormally loud ringing in my ears, my vision vibrating as if being shook by an earthquake, body lit up as if it was on fire, saturated in bliss; this bombardment of images came flooding into my mind. They came so fast and so many, it was like a VHS playback x 100. I have no idea what all of them were, and the above is the feeling I was left with.

Oddly, I am calmer, but this body feels as though it could cry.

Recollection of attachments, often precedes letting them go.

[Cal]

I've begun to think of my dreams as actually visiting another in their dreams. I do not feel that I produce them on my own, as I've started to remember more of them, all of them have had foreign feelings to them. I've noticed that only a small part of them being something that I can relate to or something that resonates visually within myself.  Perhaps I am just not able to view these deep rooted feelings everyday. If this were the case, my premise would be invalid.

I had an interesting epiphany moment sometime between the 2 dreams, or 2 visits that I can recall from last night. It seems as though something spoke to me. It told me that because I feel special due to the charisms, that ego still exists within me. While it is a little uncomfortable to view, it is true.

I recall back to family encounters over the years. While in a group, it always seemed that elder family members had their favorites, that there was inequality. Coming from a large, close living extended family (aunts, cousins, grandparents), there was alot of us. A lot of boys even, which tended to lead to altercation more often than not haha. A lot of this altercation stemmed from favoritism in the adults for some of us kids. One of my dreams last night was with an older favorite. In recollection, how everything played out, is precisely how he thinks. I recall embracing him and telling him that I loved him. After this the entire setting seemed to calm, which makes me happy. But, back to the point. Somewhere along these lines I developed a need for competition, a need for recognition. So when something told me that I felt special, or that i was unique in some way, due to the charisms, I could not deny it.

I find it interesting how this specifically has lead me. I've tended to be a know it all, and at times rampage my way into things that I probably shouldnt have. I admit, these things have been fueled by this. I feel as though I've danced around the edges of this for quite some time, but actually hearing it really gives me a clearer view of it, and hopefully it may lead to letting it go.

I wrote recently that I have been reaching out to others in more public forums. Too often have I found myself leaping off on something that I may only have a small understanding of. Perhaps some of this is also fueled by a trust in my inner guide, however, it can be reckless. These items have tended to need no explanation, as what most have been centered around, are not what should be focused on. Perhaps it is also due in part to this community of contemplatives, here at the GWV. That I have grown accustomed to speaking with those of experience, and not that of regurgitated dogma.

In these other forums, one will post something that can literally dance around the edges of a religious experience. My impulsiveness has lead me to tell them what that is, explain it, describe it, and tell them how to experience it again, however this specificity is not the way things are done here, and I understand why. Now I dont write any of this as a result of something negative coming from these events, it has been quite the opposite. I write it because I realize that while I may be able to discern something, it does not qualify me to teach it. I don't have the proper understanding of systematically reaching a goal, only a simplified shortcut to a direct experience. Perhaps this is something I might find assistance in changing here. Until then, I think I will spend less time on these other forums, and more time studying the model of the Buddha.

[Jhanananda]

I've begun to think of my dreams as actually visiting another in their dreams. I do not feel that I produce them on my own, as I've started to remember more of them, all of them have had foreign feelings to them. I've noticed that only a small part of them being something that I can relate to or something that resonates visually within myself.  Perhaps I am just not able to view these deep rooted feelings everyday. If this were the case, my premise would be invalid.

I found when I sleep with someone that we have shared dreams.  Perhaps this is true for you?

In these other forums, one will post something that can literally dance around the edges of a religious experience. My impulsiveness has lead me to tell them what that is, explain it, describe it, and tell them how to experience it again, however this specificity is not the way things are done here, and I understand why. Now I dont write any of this as a result of something negative coming from these events, it has been quite the opposite. I write it because I realize that while I may be able to discern something, it does not qualify me to teach it. I don't have the proper understanding of systematically reaching a goal, only a simplified shortcut to a direct experience. Perhaps this is something I might find assistance in changing here. Until then, I think I will spend less time on these other forums, and more time studying the model of the Buddha.

Well, there is definitely a need to avoid gossip and chatiness.  On the other hand I see no problem with any of the members of this forum sharing their understanding of religious experience on other forums.

[Cal]

I've begun to think of my dreams as actually visiting another in their dreams. I do not feel that I produce them on my own, as I've started to remember more of them, all of them have had foreign feelings to them. I've noticed that only a small part of them being something that I can relate to or something that resonates visually within myself.  Perhaps I am just not able to view these deep rooted feelings everyday. If this were the case, my premise would be invalid.

I found when I sleep with someone that we have shared dreams.  Perhaps this is true for you?

Well, this is true, yes. However, I tend to avoid this like the venerable plague. It happens though. The problem I've found with being "in-tune" with her is it becomes overwhelming pretty quickly. Shes very emotional and rather controlling. So after sharing a dream with her I tend to be anxious and have a hard time maintaining a quiet mind. This is also after sex. I tend to support her emotionally when she needs it, otherwise I keep my distance...physically and spiritually.

She'll have nightmares now and again, I'm there for her then. The world weighs heavily on her and she needs refuge, I'm there for her then. I can't help but be there when shes genuinely distraught.

In these other forums, one will post something that can literally dance around the edges of a religious experience. My impulsiveness has lead me to tell them what that is, explain it, describe it, and tell them how to experience it again, however this specificity is not the way things are done here, and I understand why. Now I dont write any of this as a result of something negative coming from these events, it has been quite the opposite. I write it because I realize that while I may be able to discern something, it does not qualify me to teach it. I don't have the proper understanding of systematically reaching a goal, only a simplified shortcut to a direct experience. Perhaps this is something I might find assistance in changing here. Until then, I think I will spend less time on these other forums, and more time studying the model of the Buddha.

Well, there is definitely a need to avoid gossip and chatiness.  On the other hand I see no problem with any of the members of this forum sharing their understanding of religious experience on other forums.

I need to take some time studying. I would hope eventually to put together a local meditation group, following the GWV model. The problem I find myself running into is without a genuine question in front of me, I do not know where to start. I think taking a step back and listening for a time might help with this.

[Jhanananda]

I need to take some time studying. I would hope eventually to put together a local meditation group, following the GWV model. The problem I find myself running into is without a genuine question in front of me, I do not know where to start. I think taking a step back and listening for a time might help with this.

I don't have a problem with anyone on this forum starting a meditation group under the auspices of the GWV.  It can be as easy as just starting a sitting group, and offering questions and answers.  And, it does not need to be as complicated as having to come up with a pithy lecture every week.

[Cal]

I began to remove the visual layer of this reality and the golden hue of the divine comes into view. The shapes dance and form a circle, and it fleets away inviting. A darkness comes and with it a new reality must be pierced. The golden shapes return, obscured by the darkness. It becomes harder to be at peace, more surrender is required. I dance with this darkness in victory and defeat. I become intent to show this darkness the light. No longer shall it see the golden, but the white. I dance with this darkness in victory and defeat. The darkness has now become two. Feelings of joy arise, as now there are two that might accompany to this place of brilliance. The white breaks through, ever dancing upon the darkest darkness. It does not like this place of white, but there it shall return upon our next meeting. Another darkness comes, but piercing through becomes easier, there is a more brilliant light in the distance. But the world has called, and I must return. Until next time darkness, I will no longer accept being your prisoner, if attached you must be, then the light we will see together.

This was an experience, much like many others, where through visual and proximal feeling, I have become immersed in an environment during deep meditation. As far as the above, I had directed awareness first into the Kasina, where I was then removed from what I stepped into, and "taken" to the place of fuckface assbags, and then, by what seems to have been by acceptance, but non-relation to them, I was able to move onward to another, less familiar place. This has become a common theme in deep meditation, although I tend to just drift with them, so I may spend time near someone here or elsewhere.

A few nights ago I had another experience like this in where, as I focused awareness into my visual, something like a dark tunnel opened up, and behind it were the stars in pristine clarity. I have seen this place one other time to my recollection, however, intuitively, it seems more familiar than I think it is. This place seemed like an endless space, and as I ventured in, it felt as though I could expand into it, and admittedly, that was a pretty scary feeling. Preceding this was a familiar feeling of rushing through the tunnel of the OOBE, however I did not leave the body, as I normally do not. Instead I sat with awareness present in this place with both mind and awareness, aware; and here-in lies a problem.

This particular meditation did produce something new; an expansive view of a beautiful, inviting, cool in feeling light blue encompassing visual view, that was accompanied with very fast, smooth motion. The coolness had a likeness of a magical feeling raindrop gently hitting my face. Yet I was moving much faster than I ever had before. I experienced this after an almost week long, sit after sit agony in the form of bad pressures and vertigo in the head. After the experience there was an odd break where I felt no charisms at all; holy crap that was weird. But I continued the sit regardless and the black tunnel showed up sometime after. I was left with a feeling as though this was a test, not the break, but the pressures and pain, and this light blue space was the reward. Often I have felt tested.

Recently I have spent time reading the writings of St. John of the cross, Journeys Out of the Body, as well as some other oddities; and I've got to say i am kicking myself for not reading them previous. Too often, I suppose, I tended to lean on assumption. This particular assumption is that i will find out in time. So I sat time and again, alot of time in agony through some very real and and immersive meditations. In these writing I have found many descriptions to experiences that were real to me, although some of them we "foggy" in my minds eye; something that is also described a lot by Robert Monroe. It makes sense, the way he seen things, how they were blurred; I've been there. This is not the way things are anymore, and have not been for awhile, clarity is in abundance at least at the visual level. Yet I feel as though I do not experience the entirety of these event; as while I have been there in awareness, it has been in "joint venture" with this stupid meat husk.

I suppose I has questions as to why this is the case; and I have searched inward for the answer and have received nothing, or that I cannot discern it. Its like there is a broken "information" pipe in my head that is flooding. Also, through these readings I have not found description of these things outside of OOBE, yet they still resonate with experiences I have had in viewing; why is this that I can see them, but not as others have/do, in the OOBE?

Sexual desire may have a play in this. But I just dont fully understand. It's as though I am constantly bombarded with influence, many influence, and to decipher them it takes an exhausting amount of insightfullness. There are times, for reasons beyond me, that I am able to hone in precisely to them, but its not sustainable. I'm more likely to go mad than to attempt this often, as I cannot fully dis-connect; so lately, I have just ignored them. I know this another problem. I just don't know anymore.